Saturday, January 23, 2010

Notes for a Theory of Information in Physics

I feel at home with these young people now. When I was in graduate school, my peers hardly talked about Information. Statistical Mechanics was the only place; there was an exception though: Prof. Luis de la Peña. At UNAM he has tried for over thirty years now to understand Quantum Mechanics as some sort of statistical description of motion.

After studying Communications Theory at ESIME, I switched to Physics, and felt that the role of Information in Physics was not clear. I decided a course of action, first learn the craft, then propose a New Kind of Science (NKS).

I am sixty years old now, and nobody has seen my NKS. My situation now is abysmal, Stephen Wolfram stole the name!

I'm kidding, Wolfram did everything on his own. He doesn't even know my idea. I presented the idea once many years ago to a group of Physics students in Puebla, Mexico. Now one of them, Jaime Díaz, is dead.

I told them that all matter evolved, not only organic, and that Information was the script it followed. The script and the matter are intimately linked, it from bit, as Prof. Wheeler, so aptly put it.

Later on in life, I learned that Maturana and Varela, had created the idea of autopoiesis.

OK, things seem to finally have come down in place. This is my first try at a synthesis of half baked ideas, cooked for well over forty years.

I start with Erik Peter Verlinde.


He looks nice, doesn't he?

I already wrote a few notes on the December revolution. There is much more I haven't had time to read, even less comment on. I read his paper, and Lee Smolin's follow up, incorporating the work of my much admired Jerzy Plebanski.

I am not in a hurry, maybe I should be, I am not getting any younger; anyway. I will reminisce about Jerzy.

I got to CINVESTAV in 1971. He wasn't there, after having being the director of the Physics Department, he went back to his country, Poland. I saw all those beautiful green notebooks on spinors and what not. The library was filled with his copious production. We didn't have a good general relativist in house; only his students were there, and they were not very well known. I remember, Prof. Rodrigo Pellicer, that had studied at ESIME like me; but the place was not a hotbed of mathematical physics by any stretch of the imagination. We got Prof. Ralph Morganstern, that worked in Brans-Dicke Theory, but he was all alone, I guess alone in more than one way. He eventually left Mexico, and I have lost his trace.

After several years at UCSB I went back to Mexico, and Jerzy was about to come back. They didn't hire me at the Physics Department, because I was still working on my PhD thesis with Bob Sugar. I got a job at the University of Puebla, and eventually became the Academic Secretary of the undergraduate physics program there. We had now some good general relativists from CINVESTAV, Profs. Gerardo Torres del Castillo, and Humberto Salazar. It was through them that Jerzy received an invitation to give a seminar at Puebla. Jerzy, my wife and I, went to eat out afterwards. I forgot who else went with us; but what I haven't forgotten was a moment in our conversation, when he told us about his Jewish friends in Warsaw that died at the hands of the Nazis; his beautiful light eyes teared up.

In 1977 he had written an important paper:

J. Plebanski, On The Separation Of Einsteinian Substructures, J. Math. Phys.18: 2511- 2520, 1977

In that paper he laid one of the foundations for what may become the Theory of Quantum Gravity.

Einstein worked with Infeld, and Infeld with Plebanski.

Plebanski had several Mexican students, unfortunately I was not one of them. One was Sabás Alarcón Gutiérrez, the Sabas I put in my first Short Story in this blog. I have lost track of Sabas, if we don't organize the search and rescue mission I describe in that story, we may never save Sabas. He is somewhere in Sonora or Sinaloa, just like Cesárea Tinajero, in the Savage Detectives.

Nowadays then, we seem to be close to a Quantum Theory of Gravity based on the insights of people younger than me, like Verlinde and Smolin.

Fortunately for my life project, those insights involve a new role for Information in the fabric of space time.

What follows is my understanding of the Nature of Information.

In the beginning nothing. Or if there was something, I don't know what it was. Then boom; there it is. I don't know where it came from, but there it was. No electron, no quark, no photon, no string, no preon: nothing.

By the way I had the fortune to meet Hidezumi Terazawa, a preon proponent. He was a friend of Jean Pestieu, that taught at CINVESTAV, while I was there. Prof. Terazawa also taught us his ideas on preons on visits to Mexico while I was at Puebla.

Information was not there either.

The problem then is to give a half baked idea of what Information is.

Here it goes:

From Terazawa pregeometry we have:

"Our general expectation is the following: under certain physical conditions, the space-time metric which is a composite of the fundamental matters would dissociate into its constituent matters, just as ordinary objects do."



Unlike Terazawa, I want to assume that before the Big Bang, there was nothing. My problem then is to figure out where the Laws of Physics come from?

This is the ultimate bootstrap. We don't even have Information. Information is an emergent property of the Universe.

In the beginning was the vacuum state. The set with nothing in it.

Information in this model is like the membrane in a living cell, and all the instructions inside that the parts use to build another copy of itself. Autopoeitic Universe. Information tells matter how to move, and matter tells Information how to evolve.

Verlinde, and all the priors that he may not be aware of, because all this was unwelcome physics, like Terazawa's pregeometry, and Erik is too young to know; has opened Pandora's box.

Gravity as emergent spacetime, as some kind of entropic force. Whatever that means.

More to come.

7 comments:

Unknown said...

Please can you tell me where you have written up your ideas about information and physics?
I am very interested in this having worked on similar concepts for a long time.
For example, I really don't think anyone understands fully what information IS and nearly all descriptions are missing a crucial component.

Eduardo Cantoral said...

Jonathan. Nice to meet you.

I am sorry to say that the ideas are only in my head now. I have not published them anywhere, whatever I have written I did not consider good enough for publication.

I feel though, that the application of thermodynamics to black hole physics is definitely a step forward, and have thought so, since Bekenstein's work appeared.

I can recommend Lorenzo Maccone:

http://relevantscience.blogspot.com/2009/08/lorenzo-maccone.html

he is into something.

Unknown said...

Cantoral,
Thanks for replying and it is good to meet you too. I see you are a maths teacher (where?) so it is easy to describe ideas. Pity this blog does not allow symbols!
Information is often described as a correlation between a and b, for example the integral of a*b over the whole space. Recognise that a and b may have different embodiments, e.g. one could be a pattern on a magnetic disk and another writing on a piece of paper. The description (above) assumes an identity function only is required to compare one with another. A little bit of thought reveals that information originated at the same point in spacetime, so the integral should be over aMb where M is the function that maps one to the other. How do you map the magnetic "information" on to the writing in the example and end up with the same thing? That is an essential part of the general "object" we call information.
In classical physics, the M is a physical operation that might be described as a computation. All instances of information form a group (non Abelian for obvious reasons). The group is an object which you'll recognise as a symmetry (there may be many instances of an "information" object such as a story in a newspaper). When the information is created or replicated, it requires symmetry breaking i.e. something called Free Energy must be lost. Symmetry isn't lost, it just fragments into smaller shards. So, the group elements are what we call "information" (which may be a fraction of a bit) and the group action is the computation sitting in spacetime (in fact in your rear facing light cone). The group is the fundamental object (not elementary particles) and the elements are associated with mass.
To go further you'd need a good understanding of physics (have you?) however understanding the universe from the point of view of such objects can be quite revealing. For example, entangled "particles" are where such an information object exists completely externally to the observer's system. The "measurement" operation of quantum mechanics is the mapping (i.e. computation M above). Note the form of Dirac brackets that (effectively) describe a measurement as a complete "information object" (this won't deal with the symbols). Another example is to realise that gravity is acting as a data compression algorithm.
Anyway I say too much and do not wish to bore you.
Best wishes
Jonathan

Eduardo Cantoral said...

I teach maths at Universidad Autónoma de Guerrero, México.
I am a Theoretical Physicist, got my PhD at UCSB in the US.

Outside of the Earth. Who is doing the writing?

I have to understand how the Information enters in the interactions of all the parts in the Universe. Without consciousness.

Unknown said...

Cantoral,
I shall try and answer your questions succinctly as I do not have much time. The answer to the conundrum of information (where people actually perceive it) is actually extremely simple but highly counter-intuitive and has many ramifications.
I am a professor in multi-discipline science including physics, mathematics electronics, computer science etc.
Information as I said is essentially symmetry. For information to be "created" free energy (a denser form of symmetry because there are many more mappings (isometries if you like)) needs to be fragmented. To explain what drives this would take too much room here. The minimum cost is kT per bit as you probably know. The process is roughly similar to "symmetry breaking" as happened in the early universe.
One way of looking at it is to realise that the electricity company is actually selling you symmetry. In using it, you are smashing it to pieces and those pieces are symmetries that wander off into the environment. You could consider each "information object" (in practice these are thoroughly mixed up)to be both ends of a symmetry with the two elements moving around and transforming, if each end can be fragmented further that might indeed happen. Of course, since "information" can be replicated (nb only in the classical world) there may be three or more elements - if one insists on a discrete representation. So, energy is basically a form of a part of symmetry and it isn't lost (conservation of energy, Noether's theorem etc.)
Another example, slightly less obvious, is to consider a powerful laser beam. Using dE=TdS it isn't difficult to see that a reasonably coherent 1kW laser beam has a temperature of nearly absolute zero. But people usually think it's hot! However, if it hits something that couples into it, there can be a lot of action! That is due to the symmetry of the beam breaking into fragments and resulting in an immense cloud of fragmented symmetries that we see as hot gases etc.

Best wishes

Jonathan

Xg said...

Hi, First, sorry for my english I am mexican and I`m trying to look for people who knew my Grandpa, Rodrigo Pellicer. He was teacher of CINVESTAR. and wrote a tesis on Static Solutions of Non-Linear Electro-Dynamics in a General Relativity.
Some one here knew him? Plese help.

Eduardo Cantoral said...

Jonathan and Gaby:

Rodrigo Pellicer was my hero.When I was a young man coming from an engineering school, it was inspiring to see Rodrigo, from my school, ESIME, working with Jerzy Plebanski, who was Leopold Infeld's collaborator, who himself had worked with Einstein.
Rodrigo joined us for some time at the University of Puebla, teaching Physics.

He was a great man.

Symmetry = Information
That is OK.
My problem is consciousness. I believe this is not necessary for Information to exist.
Information is a property assigned by us to something deeper, namely, physical objects in space and time interacting. These interactions we perceive as algorithms, rules taken, and executed. Think DNA bases leading to proteins. The words and meanings are ours; the process itself, very old.

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